As we look at the brilliance of Lt. Colonel Ellis and now hear this tragic side of a brilliant man, we look at a couple of items of interest. One, what can we learn from any new revelations in the dusty boxes of his papers that have NOT been read. Two, we are still thinking about the last wars even as we watch the new evolution of war fighting in Ukraine develop, and while everyone thinks it is fast, it has been to this writers eye, back to the future. Three, what sort of kinetic force do we need to develop to be ready for the future. Four, the NSS while quite broad laid out the route of march for the Navy and Marine Corps. Yep, MAGTF redux only at a pace and tempo we may not understand fully yet. (Hmmm anyone feeling Ellis here)
Lastly the twenty years wars of the GWOT have taken a terrible toll on our men and women who served so well, so selflessly and have retuned to a system that hands them a brown paper bag of SSRI’s and says deal with it. Like Ellis, can we afford to ignore a problem when we see it, maybe even before someone reaches out for help. Veterans typically because of their make up don’t like asking for help. Maybe as we look to warfighting systems we could look at the medical community that is supposed to treat the wounded, not just flesh wounds but the mental ones as well. An army fights on its belly, it is much more than than steel and iron and precision guided missiles. We stink at taking care of ourselves and yet, no one is coming to our rescue. Guess we better figure it out on our own, and take care of our own. Great post CDR! Many thanks for this one!
"Lastly the twenty years wars of the GWOT have taken a terrible toll on our men and women who served so well, so selflessly and have retuned to a system that hands them a brown paper bag of SSRI’s and says deal with it. Like Ellis, can we afford to ignore a problem when we see it, maybe even before someone reaches out for help."
I know people -including me- don't think much of this messenger...
Sid, I heard him on a podcast, and it was so dark and troubling that from years on active duty as infantry officer in the USMC, simply could not wrap my brain around it. I agree it is a cancer, and while the messenger maybe controversial, his message is not. No coal miner likes the canary in the coal mine. Great point and it is sort of one of those things "where do we start?" Well the beginning is good, but middle or end is fine as well, the beginning of conversion starts with that first step to Damascus.
CDR Salamander, thanks for this post. Great thesis too. My. theory is that great people are so intense, that they reach out to substance abuse to balance the boring times. What do I mean? I am a student of US Grant. He did have a drinking problem, but never while on campaign (due to his wife Julia and his Chief of Staff Rawlins), but when away from the campaign, such as his visit to New Orleans in late July 1863 to visit Banks campaign, but without either of the two mentioned above, he got so drunk, he fell off his horse (not his horse a loaner), and hurt his leg. There were several episodes like this with him. Never on the actual campaign, but when bored he turned to the drink, and it did not take a lot for him.
Grant was a noted horseman and trainer, the best West Point had seen up until that time and for many years thereafter so alcohol is the most likely culprit here.
Ernest Hemingway, an adventurous author, was addicted to alcohol as was his daughter Margaux. Both killed themselves.
American War heroes have “Procreated” among the Western Pacific Island nations.
Opium, alcohol, cocaine, heroin, and sex are sought after in America as it was during the entire 20th and even now, as evidence by our Military actions in the Caribbean.
Do we praise our current and past heroes, excusing their “Disease” and “Conduct”?
Army vs. Navy in Baltimore, MD this weekend. Shall we watch and pray together? Very respectfully, Nurse Jane
CDR Sal, a bit different from the usual FBF, but for me personally, very meaningful. Addiction is family connected for me, as is depression. Lt. Colonel Ellis obviously suffered from alcohol use disorder (in the extreme) and I'll wager manic depression (at a minimum) as well. Due to family connections, more contact with the mental health treatment community than anyone should have. Have to make the observation that the approach and quality of treatment can vary a lot because it has devolved into an emphasis on pharmacology and (IMO) endless ineffective counseling. I'd like to hope his brilliance would have overcome the likelihood of him being separated and institutionalized. Not sure that would be the case today.
"Have to make the observation that the approach and quality of treatment can vary a lot because it has devolved into an emphasis on pharmacology and (IMO) endless ineffective counseling. "
It is now it's own entrenched Rice Bowl...
And too much of a third rail topic for anyone to set straight.
The Naval Institute Press also published 21st Century Ellis in 2014, a collection of his writings with commentary by B.A. Friedman. Haven't read it personally but based on other books in the 21st Century series and reviews it's probably worthwhile.
Another great Friday post. Come for the posts and stay for the insightful comments. It appears he was driven by both mission and PTSD and paid for it. One can only hope he found some peace somewhere.
Fullbore. Yeah, as a third generation Tailhooker - I get it. In the military (particularly Naval Aviation), there's a fine line between being the life of the party and being the reason for a unit safety standdown. Papa & Grandpa Scoobs had some colorful stories of old-school booze-soaked shenanigans that would definitely not fly today: like having a CAG who got gooned up at a unit party and was later arrested by Army MPs attempting to fire up and steal a steam locomotive! He retained command by the skin of his teeth but was ordered to undergo a "in house detox" where he was locked in a BOQ room for several days with a couple of former college football JOs posted outside to keep in check. The treatment worked and CAG stayed on the wagon long enough to lead his boys in combat, picking up a Silver Star and Purple Heart in the process. A couple years later while at the war college in Newport he dropped dead of a heart attack - his hard living ways were suspected to have been a factor.
Mama Scoobs retired from a successful 20 year USN career and surprised the Scoobs clan by going back to school for a nursing degree. She ended up working in the psychiatric ward of our local hospital in a scenic seaside town that is also home to several prestigious DoD schools - you would be surprised (or maybe not) about who some of her patients were. We are all human...
And I concur with the plug for "Death by Lightning" - there's a scene in which President Garfield's daughter asks him about how he coped with his Civil War combat experiences. His response is that you have two choices: either be consumed by the darkness or gravitate towards the light by building a life that has weight and meaning. That line resonates with me as I attempt to navigate CivLant...
Great FBF. Thank you Sal. After your posting this week on the Second Island Cloud I did a little research on Ellis. Although tragic it is truly fascinating what he accomplished. We should really try and do a deep dive on the archives at NWC.
On a side note it reminded me of one of my favorite oldies…”Father Goose” starring Cary Grant.
by Mr. Gordon W. Martin (Author), Lori Wilson Byers (Editor)
GONE ASIATIC by Gordon W. Martin These are the personal memoirs of an eighteen year old, the seventh of seven brothers who joined the military from an ex-Mennonite family. He joined the navy, gained an electronics education, and matured over a four and one half year navy tour. During service school in San Diego, he practiced and paraded on a precision navy drill-team throughout southern California. He describes his experiences as a Fire Control Technician for three and a half years on the destroyer tender USS Prairie AD15, including two WestPac cruises, temporary duty stripping a mothballed cruiser USS Manchester CL83 at Vallejo, California's Mare Island Naval Shipyard, his mess-cook duty as a boot on remote, beautiful San Nicolas Island off the coast of California. He narrates his three day hitchhiking journey across the US, USS Prairie's collision with a Japanese freighter in Tokyo bay, sailors on liberty in Olongapo, Yokosuka, Hong Kong, Okinawa, Tsoying, Kaohsiung, San Francisco, San Diego. He relates the SEATO Operation Pony Express and the Prairie travel to Jesselton, British North Borneo, now Indonesia. He describes almost drowning in Subic Bay, diving with the USS Prairie divers.
Those citations are vauge enough to make me really want to know the real story. Sort of like "Actions vital to the national defense, the USS Trepang then being deployed in the Caribbean sea."
I appreciate this post - for personal and professional reasons I've spent most of my life nerding out on the Pacific War. I'm fairly well versed on the events of 1941-1945, a little less so for preceding China years, but as you rollback the timeline my knowledge slowly tapers as we get to the post-World War One era where Ellis and other prophetic observers flagged Japan as a growing threat. A favorite movie at Casa De Scoobs growing up was the NavAir classic "Task Force" in which Gary Cooper played a nonconformist naval officer who got kicked out of his cushy D.C. shore tour and banished to Panama for publicly calling out the threat of Japan while attending a diplomatic cocktail party - personally I'd take Panama over the Potomac ;-)
Reminds me of the old saying: Anyone can spot a fire, the trick is smelling the smoke!
As we look at the brilliance of Lt. Colonel Ellis and now hear this tragic side of a brilliant man, we look at a couple of items of interest. One, what can we learn from any new revelations in the dusty boxes of his papers that have NOT been read. Two, we are still thinking about the last wars even as we watch the new evolution of war fighting in Ukraine develop, and while everyone thinks it is fast, it has been to this writers eye, back to the future. Three, what sort of kinetic force do we need to develop to be ready for the future. Four, the NSS while quite broad laid out the route of march for the Navy and Marine Corps. Yep, MAGTF redux only at a pace and tempo we may not understand fully yet. (Hmmm anyone feeling Ellis here)
Lastly the twenty years wars of the GWOT have taken a terrible toll on our men and women who served so well, so selflessly and have retuned to a system that hands them a brown paper bag of SSRI’s and says deal with it. Like Ellis, can we afford to ignore a problem when we see it, maybe even before someone reaches out for help. Veterans typically because of their make up don’t like asking for help. Maybe as we look to warfighting systems we could look at the medical community that is supposed to treat the wounded, not just flesh wounds but the mental ones as well. An army fights on its belly, it is much more than than steel and iron and precision guided missiles. We stink at taking care of ourselves and yet, no one is coming to our rescue. Guess we better figure it out on our own, and take care of our own. Great post CDR! Many thanks for this one!
"Lastly the twenty years wars of the GWOT have taken a terrible toll on our men and women who served so well, so selflessly and have retuned to a system that hands them a brown paper bag of SSRI’s and says deal with it. Like Ellis, can we afford to ignore a problem when we see it, maybe even before someone reaches out for help."
I know people -including me- don't think much of this messenger...
http://newamerica.org/fellows/books/the-fort-bragg-cartel/
But he has exposed a cancer that MUST be acknowledged and addressed.
Start with understanding that:
SECRET WARS ARE STUPID
Sid, I heard him on a podcast, and it was so dark and troubling that from years on active duty as infantry officer in the USMC, simply could not wrap my brain around it. I agree it is a cancer, and while the messenger maybe controversial, his message is not. No coal miner likes the canary in the coal mine. Great point and it is sort of one of those things "where do we start?" Well the beginning is good, but middle or end is fine as well, the beginning of conversion starts with that first step to Damascus.
CDR Salamander, thanks for this post. Great thesis too. My. theory is that great people are so intense, that they reach out to substance abuse to balance the boring times. What do I mean? I am a student of US Grant. He did have a drinking problem, but never while on campaign (due to his wife Julia and his Chief of Staff Rawlins), but when away from the campaign, such as his visit to New Orleans in late July 1863 to visit Banks campaign, but without either of the two mentioned above, he got so drunk, he fell off his horse (not his horse a loaner), and hurt his leg. There were several episodes like this with him. Never on the actual campaign, but when bored he turned to the drink, and it did not take a lot for him.
Grant was a noted horseman and trainer, the best West Point had seen up until that time and for many years thereafter so alcohol is the most likely culprit here.
It was throat cancer which eventually killed U.S. Grant in 1885, probably as a consequence of years of cigar smoking.
Good Morning CDR and shipmates…
Alcoholism is a “Disease”.
Addiction is a “Motivated Behavior”.
Ernest Hemingway, an adventurous author, was addicted to alcohol as was his daughter Margaux. Both killed themselves.
American War heroes have “Procreated” among the Western Pacific Island nations.
Opium, alcohol, cocaine, heroin, and sex are sought after in America as it was during the entire 20th and even now, as evidence by our Military actions in the Caribbean.
Do we praise our current and past heroes, excusing their “Disease” and “Conduct”?
Army vs. Navy in Baltimore, MD this weekend. Shall we watch and pray together? Very respectfully, Nurse Jane
CDR Sal, a bit different from the usual FBF, but for me personally, very meaningful. Addiction is family connected for me, as is depression. Lt. Colonel Ellis obviously suffered from alcohol use disorder (in the extreme) and I'll wager manic depression (at a minimum) as well. Due to family connections, more contact with the mental health treatment community than anyone should have. Have to make the observation that the approach and quality of treatment can vary a lot because it has devolved into an emphasis on pharmacology and (IMO) endless ineffective counseling. I'd like to hope his brilliance would have overcome the likelihood of him being separated and institutionalized. Not sure that would be the case today.
"Have to make the observation that the approach and quality of treatment can vary a lot because it has devolved into an emphasis on pharmacology and (IMO) endless ineffective counseling. "
It is now it's own entrenched Rice Bowl...
And too much of a third rail topic for anyone to set straight.
Rot living under the guise of:
"For The Warfighter"
See the reference to Seth Harp's book.
Well thanks for making my "reading I'm behind on" list even longer!
Fullbore, indeed.
The Naval Institute Press also published 21st Century Ellis in 2014, a collection of his writings with commentary by B.A. Friedman. Haven't read it personally but based on other books in the 21st Century series and reviews it's probably worthwhile.
As always, there is a Midrats for that. I forgot to add the link. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/midrats/id910023979?i=1000340309103
Another great Friday post. Come for the posts and stay for the insightful comments. It appears he was driven by both mission and PTSD and paid for it. One can only hope he found some peace somewhere.
Fullbore. Yeah, as a third generation Tailhooker - I get it. In the military (particularly Naval Aviation), there's a fine line between being the life of the party and being the reason for a unit safety standdown. Papa & Grandpa Scoobs had some colorful stories of old-school booze-soaked shenanigans that would definitely not fly today: like having a CAG who got gooned up at a unit party and was later arrested by Army MPs attempting to fire up and steal a steam locomotive! He retained command by the skin of his teeth but was ordered to undergo a "in house detox" where he was locked in a BOQ room for several days with a couple of former college football JOs posted outside to keep in check. The treatment worked and CAG stayed on the wagon long enough to lead his boys in combat, picking up a Silver Star and Purple Heart in the process. A couple years later while at the war college in Newport he dropped dead of a heart attack - his hard living ways were suspected to have been a factor.
Mama Scoobs retired from a successful 20 year USN career and surprised the Scoobs clan by going back to school for a nursing degree. She ended up working in the psychiatric ward of our local hospital in a scenic seaside town that is also home to several prestigious DoD schools - you would be surprised (or maybe not) about who some of her patients were. We are all human...
And I concur with the plug for "Death by Lightning" - there's a scene in which President Garfield's daughter asks him about how he coped with his Civil War combat experiences. His response is that you have two choices: either be consumed by the darkness or gravitate towards the light by building a life that has weight and meaning. That line resonates with me as I attempt to navigate CivLant...
Proud to say I recognized his photo. Brilliant, aye. Flawed as we all are; there but for the grace of God...
Great FBF. Thank you Sal. After your posting this week on the Second Island Cloud I did a little research on Ellis. Although tragic it is truly fascinating what he accomplished. We should really try and do a deep dive on the archives at NWC.
On a side note it reminded me of one of my favorite oldies…”Father Goose” starring Cary Grant.
Poor chap went "Asiatic"....
"Here is yet another book I need to add to my library, Pete Ellis: An Amphibious Warfare Prophet, 1880-1923."
Ha! Beat yah to it!! ;-)
Picked this one up too...
https://www.amazon.com/dp/1491029501?psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&ref_=chk_typ_imgToDp
Gone Asiatic Paperback – March 3, 2014
by Mr. Gordon W. Martin (Author), Lori Wilson Byers (Editor)
GONE ASIATIC by Gordon W. Martin These are the personal memoirs of an eighteen year old, the seventh of seven brothers who joined the military from an ex-Mennonite family. He joined the navy, gained an electronics education, and matured over a four and one half year navy tour. During service school in San Diego, he practiced and paraded on a precision navy drill-team throughout southern California. He describes his experiences as a Fire Control Technician for three and a half years on the destroyer tender USS Prairie AD15, including two WestPac cruises, temporary duty stripping a mothballed cruiser USS Manchester CL83 at Vallejo, California's Mare Island Naval Shipyard, his mess-cook duty as a boot on remote, beautiful San Nicolas Island off the coast of California. He narrates his three day hitchhiking journey across the US, USS Prairie's collision with a Japanese freighter in Tokyo bay, sailors on liberty in Olongapo, Yokosuka, Hong Kong, Okinawa, Tsoying, Kaohsiung, San Francisco, San Diego. He relates the SEATO Operation Pony Express and the Prairie travel to Jesselton, British North Borneo, now Indonesia. He describes almost drowning in Subic Bay, diving with the USS Prairie divers.
My Amazon cart over-floweth.
"Aware of Ellis’s condition, the Japanese police had two bottles of whiskey delivered to him..."
That's just cold.
Imperial Japan never shied away from cold. It was EFFECTIVE and that was all that mattered. Just like Unit 731 was "effective"
Those citations are vauge enough to make me really want to know the real story. Sort of like "Actions vital to the national defense, the USS Trepang then being deployed in the Caribbean sea."
I appreciate this post - for personal and professional reasons I've spent most of my life nerding out on the Pacific War. I'm fairly well versed on the events of 1941-1945, a little less so for preceding China years, but as you rollback the timeline my knowledge slowly tapers as we get to the post-World War One era where Ellis and other prophetic observers flagged Japan as a growing threat. A favorite movie at Casa De Scoobs growing up was the NavAir classic "Task Force" in which Gary Cooper played a nonconformist naval officer who got kicked out of his cushy D.C. shore tour and banished to Panama for publicly calling out the threat of Japan while attending a diplomatic cocktail party - personally I'd take Panama over the Potomac ;-)
Reminds me of the old saying: Anyone can spot a fire, the trick is smelling the smoke!